Remember this is my journal...

[susandennis]

This entry might not sit too well with some of you regular readers. You might just want to walk on by. It's important to me and this is my journal and that's why I'm writing about it.

Yesterday in my neighborhood - at Safeco Field - there was a demonstration against gay marriage. About 20,000 of the religious right gathered to discuss their agenda. I heard a lot of conversation, mainly on the internet, about how horrible this was and how we should all right letters and make phone calls and try and get it stopped. That bothered me but I couldn't quite get my hands on why.

On my morning walk, I purposefully went by the stadium to see what the early set up was like. They had nicely made signs they were putting up everywhere politely begging people not to put up signs or banners of any kind anywhere. They were gathering around getting ready - it was still several hours away from starting.

It did creep me out. Seeing them and knowing how mean and hateful and misguided they are. And then I had the horrible thought that they might well, seeing me in the area - totally without any sign of my own beliefs - think I was one of them. I sceedaddled home.

From the news reports later I learned that they did their thing, inside the confines of the stadium. About 1,500 people of the opposite view protested the protest from outside the stadium. They carried signs and did their thing. Outside my terrace yesterday, I saw groups of women sporting pink triangles and bridal veils and men with rainbow flags walk by.

But - yeah - here's where my take on the thing might well surprise you and could piss you off.

I'm not sure that protesting the protesters was the right thing to do. The religious right are a scary bunch of people. But they have the right to be scary. They have the right to meet and discuss their views with each other. They were meeting in a confined space where no one else could see or hear them or be insulted by them. They have a right to get together and they were exercising their right. What right does anyone have to say that that is wrong?

Here's where my thoughts really got jelled.

Last night in Everett, Washington (which is just up the road about 30 minutes - a nice, kind of rural small town), gay and lesbian kids got their first Pink Prom. There was a great story about it on last night's news (and it was a FOX station). The story showed the beautiful and elaborate setting and the kids all decked out and so very happy. They interviewed the kids who were obviously thrilled to be there. It was just so nice and fun and sweet.

But the end of the story stopped me short. The reported noted that there were no protests or anyone seen or heard anywhere nearby who objected to the kids and their Pink Prom.

I was so grateful. So grateful that those kids got their night.

So grateful that the religious right did not do to the gay and lesbian kids, what my friends did to the religious right yesterday.

The whole thing still bothers me and I'm still thinking about it but I wanted to see if writing it all down might clear it up. So far, no.

Comments

WHAT???

[photoholic62.livejournal.com]

Are you saying that people should be allowed to express their own opinions, discuss their opinions with others, maybe even CHANGE their opinions in a polite, non-destructive, non-threatening way EVEN IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH THEIR OPINION? And that OTHER people who do not agree with their opinions should not be allowed to be rude, violent, destructive jerks?

Sheesh, what is the world coming to.

::removes tongue from cheek, and wanders off mumbling::

Re: WHAT???

[susandennis]

Yeah... well, I haven't actually finished thinking about it... :)

Re: WHAT???

[photoholic62.livejournal.com]

Next thing you are going to say is that we should all RESPECT differences of opinion ... respect the right to differences of opinion, and respect free-thinkers even if they have a different opinion. You might even go so far as to say "My way or the hiway" is not the most socially correct way to go about doing things.

[judith.livejournal.com]

Well, yeah, I feel the same way. You'll likely find most of your friends do. I defend the KKK's right to a parade, for that matter.

I did not object, though, to the anti-abortionists lining the streets to object to the March for Women's Lives. I wonder how I would have felt if there had been thousands of them instead of probably fewer than a hundred, though... it was smart of the march organizers to buy up all permits for that day so that the anti-abortionists could not organize an official event at the same time. Now that would or could have been ugly. What struck me about the march was how "peaceful" and friendly it was, and that's a treasure to remember.

[mickeytor.livejournal.com]

I, for one, am thrilled that the Christian Riech feels threatened enough to hold such an elaborate gathering in honor of gay marriage.

[susandennis]

What an absolutely EXCELLENT point! One TV report said that they had hoped to fill up the stadium (50,000) and only managed to get some shy of 20,000. I liked that, too.

[mickeytor.livejournal.com]

and I'll bet that for every adult there ... there were at least 2.5 kids, who, for the most part will be impacted later in life by the realities of the world and will not carry on their parents bigoted ways.

Therefore, only about 7,000 were there who really counted.

[suifu.livejournal.com]

I hear you. I was a little irritated after seeing the coverage of the event at Safeco - but then the story concerning the "Pink Prom" made me realize that there are plenty of reasonable people left who take the time to consider the needs of all. Faith in humanity restored (well, partially anyway). :)

i personally think ...

[henare.livejournal.com]

it's much better to be having these meetings out in the open ... the alternative is much scarier ... and much more dangerous.

Me too

[spiritgirl.livejournal.com]

I guess it's nice to have people just agree to disagree and go on with their life. But what happens when people feel that others are trying to squash their right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness? Not that a meeting of people who think differently is affecting your happiness...but their plans to affect laws and such would. I hate that just because I say I'm Christian that people think I want to condemn and pass jusdgement on others who live differntly then me. The religious right is scary and shameful for me. And I feel for those whose happiness is liberty is threatened by their words and actions. Hate is definitely not a family value, or a value for anyone who strives to live in harmony with others. I guess I would be on the side to see beside the scenes grass roots rising forth to promote change through education, tolerance, and sharing....rather than demonstrations of hate and judgement. The internet has made that easier to happen. I know that LJ has let me learn from all different kinds of people who might not like me or want to talk to me IRL.

I hope that people will continue to be allowed to meet peacefully....and that change can occur through sharing and listening, tolerating and supporting.

Re: Me too

[vaneramos.livejournal.com]

My take on religious tolerance is that everyone should have the freedom to hold whatever beliefs they choose, and to express them, as long as they don't attempt to interfere with anyone else's life and freedom. I think the protestors have a right to present their point of view, but not to stop the protest. Remember you're talking about two entirely different situations: some kids having a prom, and a religious group gathering to speak against the freedom and rights of another group is not exactly analgous. But again, I do agree that the right-wingers have a right to meet and express their opinions.

[quirkstreet.livejournal.com]

My only concern is about whether, if their numbers were greater, the folks on a different side of these questions than you and I would spend the time wondering about the right of others to disagree. I read an interesting article lately (don't remember where, or I'd point you at it) that talked about how liberals imagine there is a safe middle ground between liberals and conservatives, and conservatives ultimately believe that liberals have no right to exist, though they're forced to abide us for now.

I don't know how true that is, and by that logic many of my "conservative" friends would actually be "liberals" in some sense. It does speak to a FEAR many of us feel about the right.

But, of COURSE they have a right to their beliefs, short of harming me, and I agree with you that counter-demonstrations often amp up the heat without shedding light.

These things are not easy to sort out ... thanks for tossing your beliefs into the ring.

They can get together all they like, I don't care about that

[kosseferal.livejournal.com]

but when they try to codify hate and descrimination, I'm sorry, that's not right. Period.

[(Anonymous)]

The meeting in the stadium and the gay prom night are two very different kinds of events. The first is designed to stir up people to take action to restrict the rights of another, very specific group of people. Protesting this kind of public gathering is completely appropriate. The second is not a political meeting like the first, but a private one to celebrate an achievement in a few individuals' lives.

Gay protesters do not appear outside church services where people have come together to worship in a way that they see fit and to enjoy their personal religious freedom. However, the moment members of those churches decide to take political action to impose their views on society they become fair game for public protests.

[tbone.livejournal.com]

I think the part of this that bugs me most is that people are canceling Mariners season tickets (hey, I'll take 'em if you won't go!) or Safeco insurance policies because of the event. Like you say: These people have the right to peaceably assemble. I don't agree with their message at all, but they have the right to rent a venue to hold their conference or whatever.

[geordie.livejournal.com]

I don't have a problem with a quiet protest against people who are protesting against you. If both sides can have some say without any heads getting broken then why not.

To me the gay marriage thing is such a non-event, I think in twenty years time the people currently protesting against it won't want to admit they were in the same city. Just like interracial marriage.

The anti-gay thing still seems to cling to the idea that being gay is a choice, perhaps if someone is bisexual then it is as they could go either way. But some of my gay friends are as fixed in their ways as I am, my friend Angie is as male as any male I know... other than the obvious differences.

Anyway. When you are being attacked I think you have the right to reply. The pink prom isn't against anyone, but the christian right meeting is. To be fair though, the christian right may feel that the whole gay marriage thing is an attack on them, but I still can't see the pink prom as anything other than a bunch of kids at a special occasion.

[dizzdvl.livejournal.com]

I think I understand what you mean. It has always bothered me when people who claim to be open-minded refuse to let others believe what they want. Who gets to determine what is right? I know I can determine what I think is right for myself, but I really can't force that on anyone else. It's the whole holier-than-thou attitude that annoys the crap out of me.